The "S" Word

A place for discussions surrounding marriage. Marrieds and singles welcome.

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Edwards1984 » Tue Aug 13, 2013 5:04 pm

All right, for the sake of conversation, in keeping it terse and on topic and avoiding rabbit trails, I will narrow it down to this:

r035198x wrote:
Edwards1984 wrote:Please explain these two positions and how they do not contradict.

The same way you don't see a contradiction in making women keep quiet in church but allow them to not have their heads covered while praying.


My friend, with all due respect, you are avoiding giving a direct answer, and are attempting a red herring. And I'm certain others in the forum can see what you are doing. If you are unsure how to defend your position, just say "I need more time to think on it," or "I was incorrect, my thinking is matured now." If you are able to defend your position regarding how your interpretation of Galatians 3 regarding submission and what Paul teaches about submission, then please do so.

Thus, permit to repeat my previous post:

r035198x wrote:...under the Spirit we are all one and will submit to each other equally with no one always having the final say.


The Apostle Paul in Ephesians 5:22-24 wrote:Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body. But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.


Please explain these two positions and how they do not contradict.
"And how the Lord has a little left me, how weak do I find myself! O, let it teach me to depend less on myself, to be more humble, and to give more of the praise of my ability to Jesus Christ." Jonathan Edwards (from his journal)
User avatar
Edwards1984
 
Posts: 644
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:04 pm
Location: Virginia

Re: The "S" Word

Sponsor

Sponsor
 

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Amber » Tue Aug 13, 2013 5:36 pm

Edwards1984 wrote:All right, for the sake of conversation, in keeping it terse and on topic and avoiding rabbit trails, I will narrow it down to this:

r035198x wrote:
Edwards1984 wrote:Please explain these two positions and how they do not contradict.

The same way you don't see a contradiction in making women keep quiet in church but allow them to not have their heads covered while praying.


My friend, with all due respect, you are avoiding giving a direct answer, and are attempting a red herring. And I'm certain others in the forum can see what you are doing.


Actually Tony, I don't see that you have responded yet to his question directly and with scripture to cement why you don't believe that head coverings are not Biblically mandated but women keeping quiet in church is. Most of his questions have not been answered by you directly but more so with you responding with a question of your own trying to keep the conversation in the direction you desire.

Of course, I might have glazed over but did you even say that you agree that women are subjected to different rules of behavior than men in church? I didn't see that...

*I should say that I don't personally think either of you are correct. I've just been following the conversation as I find it interesting, the different view points. I think you are very good at explaining your position Tony so my interest is really in seeing you not avoid his questions and give more direct responses.
User avatar
Amber
 
Posts: 229
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 12:54 pm

Re: The "S" Word

Postby r035198x » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:09 pm

No sure if my last post was removed (as inappropriate) or simply didn't make it (am still working out how to use the forum software works).

But it was basically to say that I have already stated that I don't take all Paul's guidelines to the churches for literal application today. Context and culture are key. You have also indicated that you don't do the same re ch11.
I had also mentioned that I've lost patience with how the conversation is going. You already stated that I did't study the subject, made up arguments for me and are obviously convinced that your position is correct no matter what anyone posts. It's ok if you won't deal with any of what I'm posting, I intended more to just state my interpretation which is contrary to yours than argue your position as wrong anyway. I probably stated those things in much stronger wording hence the suspicion that it was removed. I just can't get past that you are not treating my posts with any respect here and I just don't need any of that now. Sorry for the trouble all the same.

Kind regards

r035198x
r035198x
 
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2013 6:08 am

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Edwards1984 » Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:10 pm

Amber wrote:Actually Tony, I don't see that you have responded yet to his question directly and with scripture to cement why you don't believe that head coverings are not Biblically mandated but women keeping quiet in church is. Most of his questions have not been answered by you directly but more so with you responding with a question of your own trying to keep the conversation in the direction you desire.

Of course, I might have glazed over but did you even say that you agree that women are subjected to different rules of behavior than men in church? I didn't see that...

*I should say that I don't personally think either of you are correct. I've just been following the conversation as I find it interesting, the different view points. I think you are very good at explaining your position Tony so my interest is really in seeing you not avoid his questions and give more direct responses.


I linked to the thread where I discussed head coverings - if you think I have been insufficient, I would turn the conversation there. The very reason it came up was, frankly, a red herring, because I was pointing out that r035198x's overall conclusion regarding Galatians 3 - if true - was contradictory to Paul's other statements. In my earlier post, I had mentioned two posts - one of them was from 1 Corinthians. r035198x honed in on that one, then tried to argue that the Corinthian epistles were not for all time. I pointed to the passage in 1 Timothy to demonstrate that it was more than just a Corinthian affair. He ignored all that I was saying and attempted to transform the conversation to one about whether or not Paul's epistle to the Corinthians were applicable for all time or the entire church.

If you follow the flow of conversation, you will see that the reason I am backing off from some of his questions is not because I cannot answer them, but because they are not related to the subject of the OP or my question regarding r035198x's interpretation of "submission" based on Galatians 3. If the rabbit trail into 1 Corinthians is relevant, I would invite you to demonstrate how.

r035198x wrote:No sure if my last post was removed (as inappropriate) or simply didn't make it (am still working out how to use the forum software works).

But it was basically to say that I have already stated that I don't take all Paul's guidelines to the churches for literal application today. Context and culture are key. You have also indicated that you don't do the same re ch11.
I had also mentioned that I've lost patience with how the conversation is going. You already stated that I did't study the subject, made up arguments for me and are obviously convinced that your position is correct no matter what anyone posts. It's ok if you won't deal with any of what I'm posting, I intended more to just state my interpretation which is contrary to yours than argue your position as wrong anyway. I probably stated those things in much stronger wording hence the suspicion that it was removed. I just can't get past that you are not treating my posts with any respect here and I just don't need any of that now. Sorry for the trouble all the same.


r035198x, I simply challenged your exposition of Galatians 3 - which was not talking about submission - by asking you to remain consistent with those writings of Paul which do speak on submission. I haven't seen you yet attempt to deal with them - if you did respond to how Galatians 3 and Ephesians 5 jive with one another, I invite you to demonstrate how, or show me which post you made where you did deal with it (I might have missed it). If you think Paul's commands regarding submission between believing wives and husbands aren't relevant for today, demonstrate why from the context of Ephesians 5 or the parallel verse in Colossians. If you are offended because I suggested you study the topic more in depth, I apologize, but a person who has studied a scriptural topic usually understands the verses dealing with the topic, not trying to grab an unrelated passage and form a philosophical argument from it.

I invite you, again, to study Ephesians 5 in depth, and review how the apostle Paul himself defined submission between husband and wife. God bless.
Last edited by Edwards1984 on Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"And how the Lord has a little left me, how weak do I find myself! O, let it teach me to depend less on myself, to be more humble, and to give more of the praise of my ability to Jesus Christ." Jonathan Edwards (from his journal)
User avatar
Edwards1984
 
Posts: 644
Joined: Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:04 pm
Location: Virginia

Re: The "S" Word

Postby little_tigress » Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:19 pm

we don't delete posts outright here, and certainly not without informing the poster, so that was likely a glitch. Or perhaps someone posted before you got a chance and it stopped you in case you wanted to modify. Thats happened to me a few times. If you're not watching, its easy to think that your post has gone through by that point and you move on to other things.
❥ ~❥~ ❥ ~ ❥ ~ ❥ ~ ❥ ~ ❥ ~ ❥
Qu'ils sont beaux sur les montagnes, Les pieds de celui qui apporte de bonnes nouvelles, Qui publie la paix! De celui qui apporte de bonnes nouvelles, Qui publie le salut! De celui qui dit à Sion: ton Dieu règne!
Ésaïe 52:7
little_tigress
 
Posts: 4017
Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:15 pm
Location: Canada

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Ethnog » Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:10 pm

To add on to what Shari stated, that has happened to me as well. I thought I posted a comment but it did not go through. Also, because of my browser I post comments and then it logs me off automatically so my posts never show up. I just give up when that happens. lol.
Lift like a man; look like a goodness.
User avatar
Ethnog
 
Posts: 2107
Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:22 pm

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Wesley » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:38 am

r035198x wrote:No sure if my last post was removed (as inappropriate) or simply didn't make it (am still working out how to use the forum software works)

I checked the moderator log and there was no post deletion.

little_tigress wrote:we don't delete posts outright here, and certainly not without informing the poster, so that was likely a glitch. Or perhaps someone posted before you got a chance and it stopped you in case you wanted to modify. Thats happened to me a few times. If you're not watching, its easy to think that your post has gone through by that point and you move on to other things.

What she said.

r035198x, the only posts that get deleted outright with no trace are spam posts. Even posts with inappropriate content will have the content removed and the action described and signed within the post that was moderated. (BTW, "inappropriate" by our community standards, have to be pretty rough to warrant a direct moderator intervention - lesser infractions are encouraged to be dealt with on an interpersonal level)

TL;DR I dunno what happened to your post. :(
User avatar
Wesley
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2202
Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:03 pm
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Wesley » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:41 am

Ethnog wrote:To add on to what Shari stated, that has happened to me as well. I thought I posted a comment but it did not go through. Also, because of my browser I post comments and then it logs me off automatically so my posts never show up. I just give up when that happens. lol.

Argh - we never figured that out did we? It's a Safari safemode setting, I'm almost positive. Drat.

r035198x, in addition, here's what might have happened (not to hijack this thread away from the great discussion going on - sorry to take the wind out of everyone's sales. Promise I'll go away after this post! :lol: )
  1. You click "reply" or "quote" and are in the editor page.
  2. Someone else posts something while you're making your post.
  3. You finish making your post and you click "Submit"
  4. Your post is not submitted, but instead you see, above the editor, the post(s) that have been made since you started editing. The idea is that you may want to change your post based on the new information in the thread.
  5. You have to click "submit" again to get the post to actually be posted.

Sometimes folks don't expect that and close the browser window and the post never gets submitted. :|
User avatar
Wesley
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2202
Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:03 pm
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona

Re: The "S" Word

Postby Queen Sophie_Ann » Wed Aug 14, 2013 4:42 am

NO way, NO how - my husband and I will be equals, that's for sure.
Queen Sophie_Ann
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Aug 14, 2013 4:39 am
Location: Louisiana

Re: The "S" Word

Postby r035198x » Wed Aug 14, 2013 5:45 am

I almost believed you all. I can envision Shari and G dividing up parts of my post among each other with Wes moderating the activities in quiet satisfaction right now ...
r035198x
 
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2013 6:08 am

PreviousNext

Return to Married Life

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

About us

ChattyChristians.com is a place for Christians of all walks to chat, discuss, and fellowship with one another. We seek to live out our mission statement with humility and sincerity.

Have questions? Contact us at support@chattychristians.com or join ChattyChristians.com and submit a question to our Member Help Desk. You might also be interested in our FAQ and Privacy Policy.

cron